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Post by Badwater on Sept 9, 2010 22:01:16 GMT -5
Beware of Smuggler's Point!!From this point on, Smuggler's Point will be a full PVP area. PCs may be killed or pickpocketed in accordance with server rules. My feeling on this is that if you go to Smuggler's, you knew what is was when you went in. It is a nasty, dog-eat-dog area where the law of the jungle rules and if you're a pipsqueak then don't go there. For now, Smuggler's point is the only area where this kind of PvP will be allowed. Pickpocketing must be within reason: You're not going to be able to sneak off with a fighter's prized +4 tower shield! PPing will be limited to items that take up one or two squares of inventory. Anything larger must be returned OOC either in person or have a DM return the item. I've seen PvP go bad in the past but I'm trusting that we have competent players that can steal from each other and be mature about it. You don't want my wrath if you screw it up. I may add some other lawless areas where wanton evil and chaos are allowed as well. More on that later.
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HC Sayuri
Monk
"Under one Holy Sigil we are joined, for the Honor of the Crown, and the Crusade of Good!"
Posts: 256
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Post by HC Sayuri on Sept 10, 2010 7:43:58 GMT -5
Ooooo.... Aishi is going to love hanging out there!
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Post by slidermike on Sept 10, 2010 8:00:10 GMT -5
*raises his hand* I have a question/concern and comments about making smugglers a full pvp. Since you moved the blackhearted diamond up there and thats one of the staple scripted quests; arent you by default then pointing players up in that direction? To me, having a place were epic lvl rogues hang out (one example=Osa) that also has one of the most commonly done scripted quest items just feels out of sorts. I for one am not a fan of PvP pickpocketing and have several bad memories of it going on in Talus about 4yrs ago.
I wish nothing to do with any non consentual PvP period.
Not knowing how to say that in any way that doesn't sound unhappy is where I am so don't take it personal. Expressing my disagreement with the current direction of smugglers.
An acceptable solution would be to move the diamond to another location.
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Post by Edohvi on Sept 10, 2010 9:13:25 GMT -5
I tend to agree with Slider because I do remember instances of pickpocketing that wasn't overseen by a DM which got a little out of hand. Also, the current standard for PvP seems to keep everything at a more rp perspective without things getting taken OOC. I also think that no scripted quests should be located near anything like this... my concern is the same as Slider's as well. And speaking of these quests, since many have been changed/updated there needs to be some manner of making it known. I have yet to find the npc that starts the "Brand on the Run' quest. And Cthorna's hints for the diamond and decanter don't seem altered enough to let those older players know that things have changed. Is the 'Wedding Ring' quest removed? Does the 'Bahamut' quest work now? ...sorry, my mind started stumbling on me...
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Post by Badwater on Sept 10, 2010 12:00:34 GMT -5
*raises his hand* I have a question/concern and comments about making smugglers a full pvp. Since you moved the blackhearted diamond up there and thats one of the staple scripted quests; arent you by default then pointing players up in that direction? To me, having a place were epic lvl rogues hang out (one example=Osa) that also has one of the most commonly done scripted quest items just feels out of sorts. I for one am not a fan of PvP pickpocketing and have several bad memories of it going on in Talus about 4yrs ago. I wish nothing to do with any non consentual PvP period. Not knowing how to say that in any way that doesn't sound unhappy is where I am so don't take it personal. Expressing my disagreement with the current direction of smugglers. An acceptable solution would be to move the diamond to another location. That Blackhearted Diamond might be moved. Or it might go away. Or it might become something else. Or it might not. Choosing not to do a quest is a choice, and no one forces you or anyone else to take on a quest. The xp in the Blackhearted Diamond quest will reflect possible PvP risks in comparison to other quests.
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Post by Badwater on Sept 10, 2010 12:24:31 GMT -5
I tend to agree with Slider because I do remember instances of pickpocketing that wasn't overseen by a DM which got a little out of hand. Also, the current standard for PvP seems to keep everything at a more rp perspective without things getting taken OOC. I also think that no scripted quests should be located near anything like this... my concern is the same as Slider's as well. And speaking of these quests, since many have been changed/updated there needs to be some manner of making it known. I have yet to find the npc that starts the "Brand on the Run' quest. And Cthorna's hints for the diamond and decanter don't seem altered enough to let those older players know that things have changed. Is the 'Wedding Ring' quest removed? Does the 'Bahamut' quest work now? ...sorry, my mind started stumbling on me... 1) I don't think the current player base will logistically raise the risk of PvP on Smuggler's Point all that much. That is to say, it's been a long long long time since I saw anyone else there when I was on Smuggler's. But it's a den of thieves and pirates; what's to be expected there? Are they making sand castles and reading Goodnight Moon to the little pirates there before tucking them in to bed? Or are things expected to be rough and tumble? It's one area. I think that if players don't want to take the risk involved in visiting one area then there's, what, over 850 others to choose from? 2) As far as quests go, all the quests you talk about are still there. If old timers are having difficulty then it very well may be a case of running around on auto-pilot and having difficulty breaking from that. I've run quests where I could not make something more plain to the players and they just don't get it. Do some exploring and notice things! For example, did you ever notice that the Challenger's Inn has a back room?
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Post by Badwater on Sept 10, 2010 12:31:13 GMT -5
... I do remember instances of pickpocketing that wasn't overseen by a DM which got a little out of hand. Also, the current standard for PvP seems to keep everything at a more rp perspective without things getting taken OOC. .... ...I've seen PvP go bad in the past but I'm trusting that we have competent players that can steal from each other and be mature about it. You don't want my wrath if you screw it up. ...
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Post by slidermike on Sept 10, 2010 13:25:45 GMT -5
So are you saying its the NPC who are going to get an AI make over so some if not all of them will have skill points in Pick Pocket? That, to me actually sounds intriquing! If thats the case then lets make it known. Those are the NPC and not PC. When an NPC does an automated task there is no choice to do or not to do a given action. A PC on the other hand is completely driven by the human at the keyboard; and people do take personal the theft by another person. By taking one of the most well known and done monthly set of quests and landing it in the middle of a PvP area then telling the players no one is forcing you into going there or do the quest. Thats just unreasonably unagreable BW. You have two of the small existing player base expressing concern about that specific issue and instead of taking it you counter back with maybe, maybe not and no one is forcing you to do anything. Have the remote PvP area great! Have scripted quest areas seperate is my point. I dont see how you can put into the xp reward equation a formula for a pick pocketed items value. The Database does not know if character x was PP'd and if so, what the gp value of the item is. Some items that fit into the one/two space size can be of quite value such as rings of greater spell storing or as lowly as a mineral ore. Sorry that its a disjointed set of thoughts. I am also aware that what were trying to express online quite often comes across as mean or butt headed. Be assured that in my previous comments on this thread and the current comment I mean no personal attack; no sandbagging or otherwise demeaning of BW, Mysterling or any other person real or ficticious. I am expressing my thoughts, concerns and frustration about what from my one narrow perspective is.
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Post by Osa on Sept 10, 2010 19:37:51 GMT -5
Just a note... I came from a PW ( now closed) that allowed PP PVP and alot of times it went very bad. In fact I would have guard chasing Osa all over for thing she did not steal totally not a RP chase and she spent most her time in a Jail which was for most purposes a DM jail ( cause unless the dm let you out of the "player" jail you would stay till they saw fit or bail was posted (Aelos bailed Osa out a lot)) In fact the jail cell had her name over the entrance. It might be of concern to some players I will mis use Osa for pping. I did PP I never took anything I did not give back ooc . If I took gold well depending on how much gold a player had, that might be kept ;D I see a bit of rp mind you. This is in no way connected to what BW might or might not have in mind. Osa helping players have a safe visit to Smugglers. ( remember to her, its her island to Davy Jones locker with the Baron : Also If a Rogue ( members of the EN) was being chased then The EN would have a true purpose it was intended to have a Haven for Rogues that unless you're a dm no guards can gain entrance to it.. Now if Osa catchs wind of Rogues being Chased ( None EN members) she would open her doors somehow to other Rogues. That would take some thinking out on my part, how to have a key for non members to gain entrance to the haven ( upstairs area). Which I am sure a DM can get them access to.. I too am not trying to bash heads just heading off at the pass some concerns I am sure there might be. Along with some of my past experiances. I personally am looking forward to the change at Smugglers.. Long live the Rogues... I also mean no ill feelings toward anyone real or non real.. (( my english is bad so I will say it best I can phase)) I have no dm or admin powers on Talus. BW pulls no punches with me. I do nt have the ablity in any way shape or form to convince BW to change Talus... I dont mean for the above to come across mean or wrong.. Just I feel some players might think I get what I want IG.
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Post by Osa on Sept 13, 2010 18:33:38 GMT -5
I have a quick question how will the old rule of not killing NPC's work?
Several of Smuggles where attacked and some killed..
RP wise Osa will not stand for this.
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HC Sayuri
Monk
"Under one Holy Sigil we are joined, for the Honor of the Crown, and the Crusade of Good!"
Posts: 256
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Post by HC Sayuri on Sept 13, 2010 18:49:44 GMT -5
I have a quick question how will the old rule of not killing NPC's work? Several of Smuggles where attacked and some killed.. RP wise Osa will not stand for this. I believe the current written rule is, that if an NPC attacks you, you can kill it. Its a good question tho, how would such a rule work in a full PVP, rough and tumble, anythings possible town like SP work? If the NPCs are getting killed, maybe the NPCs should be tougher? Should they be immortal? I had thought there were several spots around the town were smugglers spawned and attacked people, so isn't that the point? I would think that would keep with the new vision of SP.
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Post by Osa on Sept 13, 2010 19:11:52 GMT -5
I have a quick question how will the old rule of not killing NPC's work? Several of Smuggles where attacked and some killed.. RP wise Osa will not stand for this. I believe the current written rule is, that if an NPC attacks you, you can kill it. Its a good question tho, how would such a rule work in a full PVP, rough and tumble, anythings possible town like SP work? If the NPCs are getting killed, maybe the NPCs should be tougher? Should they be immortal? I had thought there were several spots around the town were smugglers spawned and attacked people, so isn't that the point? I would think that would keep with the new vision of SP. THey are not imnmortal in SP.. I know there are some that are suppost to be killed to get ex item.. so this might be an interresting question.
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HC Sayuri
Monk
"Under one Holy Sigil we are joined, for the Honor of the Crown, and the Crusade of Good!"
Posts: 256
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Post by HC Sayuri on Sept 13, 2010 19:23:05 GMT -5
I believe the current written rule is, that if an NPC attacks you, you can kill it. Its a good question tho, how would such a rule work in a full PVP, rough and tumble, anythings possible town like SP work? If the NPCs are getting killed, maybe the NPCs should be tougher? Should they be immortal? I had thought there were several spots around the town were smugglers spawned and attacked people, so isn't that the point? I would think that would keep with the new vision of SP. THey are not imnmortal in SP.. I know there are some that are suppost to be killed to get ex item.. so this might be an interresting question. From what I remember, all quest specific NPCs (that weren't intended to be killed) were made immortal many many years ago so as to keep quests from getting broken. So, I'm guessing that if NPCs got killed, they were not important to any specific quest. I can think of at-least 5 NPC in SP that are actually intended to be killed for the sake of a quest or plot. Perhaps some of the others got involved when they shouldn't have?
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Post by duster on Sept 14, 2010 8:20:22 GMT -5
So just so im clear one can attack another on smuglers no questions asked? Of coarse with respect. ;D If this is the case Sign me up A.S.A.P.
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Post by Edohvi on Sept 14, 2010 9:47:26 GMT -5
So we are steering away from the rules for PvP that have been on Talus or is this just for Smuggler's Point? I thought the rules were set to deter those gamers who like to gain levels fast so they can run around pking others? The few instances I have either been involved or around PvP the attacking was done with true rp involved not one side's version of it. I'm not talking out against Osa's running SP. I just know from past experiences that opening up the avenue for unsupervised pking without both pcs' consent can bring about false rp just for the sake of killing another pc. Having been around several different players that enjoy being 'evil' ingame, not everyone understands or cares to rp the wicked like most others may expect. Anyhow, I didn't mean to write a novel, I just see breaking away from the set rules of PvP even on SP could cause bad things to happen.
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